By luck I have found a reference to a book on Epicureanism and early Christianity (it's quite interesting to myself because I am currently reading DeWitt's "St. Paul and Epicurus". It's titeled "You will not taste death: Jesus and Epicureanism" by Jack W. Hannah. Does anyone know more about the book or the author or already know something on the connection between the Gospel of Thomas and Epicureanism?
"You will not taste death: Jesus and Epicureanism"
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I do not think I have heard of that. Please keep us posted on what you make of it.
Other than DeWitt's work, the only similar thing I am aware of - and it's not explicitly Epicurean but rather "materialism" - is the article from the early 1800's by Thomas Cooper "The Scripture Doctrine of Materialism" which gives his argument that a close reading of the bible supports the view that the human soul was viewed as a material thing in some of the biblical texts.
https://thomascoopermd.wordpress.com/the-scripture-…of-materialism/
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I read most of the book and definitely have some observations.
He proposes that Epicurean philosophy not only influenced the development of early Christianity, but may even a primary influence on the apocryphal Gospel of Thomas. His thesis relies on several assumptions that I think are difficult to prove, that the Gospel of Thomas is an authentic representation of early Christianity, that the life of the Jesus of the Gospels can be adequately reconstructed, and that the Jesus of the Gospels was an Epicurean wise man.
He heavily relies on personal speculation to further his propositions.
Chronologically, the Gospel of Thomas was written sometime after Mark, Matthew, Luke, and the hypothesized "Q" Gospel from which Matthew and Luke both drew. Most scholars date Thomas closer to John (if not explicitly after it), sometime at the beginning of the 2nd-century along with other, apocryphal writings of Gnostics. Given this chronology, the Gnostic tone, and the later rejection of this gospel of Biblical canon, it seems unlikely that the Gospel of Thomas is a useful historical text from which to reconstruct a sketch of the allegedly historical figure called Jesus.
Hannah spends a significant chapter exploring "the paranormal" and speculates that Jesus may have been connected to ancient paranormal activity. He catalogues various accounts of "inexplicable" phenomena reported throughout the modern era to help substantiate his claim and further speculates that the "miracles" of Jesus were actual instances of extraordinary phenomena controlled by a wise man connected with "the paranormal". This chapter is a good example of Hannah's general approach, hand-picked evidence, a lack of peer review, and personal speculations.
The rest of the book is a commentary on each Jesus Saying in The Gospel of Thomas. The connections drawn between most of the sayings and Epicurean philosophy are tenuous (much like our recent discussions about Buddhism). While Hannah does find several interesting connections, the lack of an ability to definitively demonstrate Thomas as an Epicurean document, and Jesus as an Epicurean philosopher neutralizes the speculation.
I think De Witt makes the best argument for a connection between Epicurean philosophy and Christianity based on the historical tensions documented in the Pauline Epistles and Paul's appropriation of Epicurean vocabulary and techniques to evangelize a non-Christian, Greek audience. Beyond Paul, I don't think we'll find any Epicurean connections with the character of Jesus from the Gospels. There are obvious connections with Philo's Neo-Platonic Judaism, with the eschatological John the Baptist and the community of the Essenes, with the anti-imperialism of the Zealots, and, most of all given the likely historical context, as one (of many) 1st-century Jewish Messiah-claimants.
Personally, I believe that any investigation of "the historical figure of Jesus" needs to begin with an honest attempt to authenticate his historicity as a verifiable individual, and not just the amalgamation of similar stories of Jewish guys named "Josh" who claimed to be the Messiah and were executed by the Roman empire. Besides several very brief anecdotes from Flavius Josephus, Tacitus, and Pliny, we lack the evidence to authenticate his identity. It seems odd to me that someone writing from an Epicurean perspective would jump straight to the claim that "Not only did Jesus exist ... but also he harnessed psychic energy to heal people with Epicurean magic."
I think Hannah set out to try to prove a highly imaginative fiction. He paints a colorful picture that would be the perfect topic for late night on the History Channel, but not something constructive to our study as Epicureans.
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Given the quality of his posts I suspect Nate has retired and gone into full-time Epicurean commentary. Another great post.
Last time I did not bother to look up that book. Here's a link or two:
So it's fairly recent: https://www.amazon.com/You-will-not-t…h/dp/B0006FANBK
You Will Not Taste DeathA fine softcover copy. Indexed. Light shelf wear. Tight binding. Clean, unmarked pages. Not ex-library. Shipped Weight: Under 1 kilogram....www.goodreads.comI can't find much else as to who Hannah is or his views.
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I think Hannah set out to try to prove a highly imaginative fiction. He paints a colorful picture that would be the perfect topic for late night on the History Channel, but not something constructive to our study as Epicureans.
I did it again
. This time I was able to read approximately half of the book before I had to return the interlibrary loan.This was a journey into esotericism derived from Epicurean philosophy!
To keep it short, according to how I understand his writings: Hannah argues that Jesus' message opens the door to the heavenly realms of the Epicurean Gods. Everyone can build an heavenly avatar by sending images of oneself to the heavenly realms and this avatar continues one's life after the earthly death.
Hannah's claim is highly speculative, but indeed, from an Epicurean point of view this answers questions about the Christian faith, how the resurrection and the afterlife can be packed in a sound thought structure.
His arguments can hardly be proven, but they raise interesting questions: How did the early Christians imagine how the afterlife works physically? What is "heaven"? There are many questions on early Christianity and even theologians may have no clear view on how to solve these issues.
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I had forgotten about this so thanks for the update. Is this guy an absolute kook or someone trying to make money on esoteric speculation or what? It doesn't sound like a promising time investment for a Christiwn or an Epicurean or anyone else unless he's got *some* kind of textual basis for his ideas.
But if he was able to keep Twentier and Titus reading for so long he must be a good writer?
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I have not read that book, but just reflecting...as I was raised Christian so the statement "you will not taste death" meant that the soul does not die when the body dies, because the soul is eternal.
For Epicureans the opposite is believed...in De Rerum Natura, Book 3, the nature of the soul is mortal...it will die when the body dies.
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Is this guy an absolute kook or someone trying to make money on esoteric speculation or what? It doesn't sound like a promising time investment for a Christiwn or an Epicurean or anyone else unless he's got *some* kind of textual basis for his ideas.
I would rather call him creative
. His main argument is that the epistle of Thomas is a document preserving original sayings of Jesus. In contrast, he suggests that the four canonical epistles are later, mostly fictional stories. He further argues that there are hardly any references to God and supernatural experiences in the epistle of Thomas to find. The main topic of the epistle of Thomas is the "Kingdom of Heaven" and Hannah puts this into his construction of thought. He interprets passages according to his own claims. For example, when Jesus speaks of his father in heaven, this is not an all powerful god but an heavenly avatar.For Epicureans the opposite is believed...in De Rerum Natura, Book 3, the nature of the soul is mortal...it will die when the body dies.
This is extremely interesting, because Hannah develops further the theory of gods and heavenly realms in how they interact with the earthly realm. He argues that there is not only a flow of images to our world, but in the opposite direction, too. He mentions some references in the Herculaneum papyri to strengthen his arguments.
Hannah's key point is that Jesus teaches how to manifest yourself in the heavenly realm, where you go beyond mortality. You will not taste death.
As speculative as it is, Hannah still creates a quite attractive alternative story of salvation that is able to integrate Epicurean physics. Relating to St. Augustine: I would give him the palm
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Yeah, I'm probably not going to read the book. However, "not taste of death" only seems to occur in the three canonical synoptic gospels: Mark, Matthew, and Luke (in that chronological order):
Genesis 1:1 (KJV)"Not" AND "taste" AND "death" primary search results are listed below along with dictionary aides, FAQs, and Lexiconc.www.blueletterbible.orgIt's Jesus failed prophecy that the end of the world was coming before some in his audience died. That didn't happen. Bart Ehrman had a great podcast episode on this failed apocalyptic prophecy recently:
The Gospel of Thomas uses the phrase, but it's so cryptic that anyone can say it means almost anything. The only full manuscript we have of Thomas is much younger than the canonical and in Coptic. There are earlier Greek fragments, but only fragments.
The "death taste" occurs in Logion 1, 18, 19, and 85, and is again so cryptic that it's like a Rohrschach inkblot: "What do you see?"
So, from the description, I'd agree with Titus that Hannah was...creative, maybe bordering on speculative fiction.
Additional resources:
The true words of Thomas (Interactive Coptic-English gospel of Thomas)This groundbreaking translation of the "gospel of Thomas" follows the Coptic to the letter and reveals dozens of new words and meanings,…www.academia.eduThe Gospel of Thomas Collection - Translations and Resources
Gospel of Thomas - Wikipediaen.wikipedia.org
